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 Post subject: Sonor Designer floor tom mounts won't hold legs w/o mem lock
PostPosted: Mon Jun 26, 2017 6:03 pm 
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Joined: Sun Jun 26, 2011 3:34 pm
Posts: 26
Location: Austin, TX
I am the proud owner of a new (to me) 5 piece Sonor Designer kit. They lived most of their life and in a Reno, NV area church so they're in super great shape for their age! Bought them without a chance to see them first (shipping to Austin was ridiculous) and I am now familiarizing myself with this crazy over engineered hardware!!

The kit has 2 floor toms... both on 3 legs. All 6 f/t mounts are giving me issues. None of them will secure the legs without the assistance of the memory locks. I have cranked as hard as I can and the legs still slip.... all of them.

It's worth mentioning that the 6 very thin 2" diameter plastic washers that go inside the round handles have all broken and/or corroded. They're all fubar'd. Please see linked Dropbox pictures.

I thought these missing/broken plastic washers might be the culprit so I tried a homemade fix with 2" wide neoprene gaskets from Lowe's/Depot. I cut out the middle of them to get the 1 &1/4" sized hole... but still no luck.

Could it be the springs inside are so old and won't hold the legs as new?

dunno what else to try... If anyone here has experience with these f/t mounts I'd appreciate some guidance!

...so thanks in advance for help, info comments & replies. It's the first Designer kit I've ever owned.

Here's the Dropbox link with pictures. It appears this particular forum topic doesn't let you upload attachments by default directly in the post.

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/7osxb6p5gcga ... 5Hjva?dl=0


Best,

Mike H
Austin, TX


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 Post subject: Re: Sonor Designer floor tom mounts won't hold legs w/o mem
PostPosted: Tue Jun 27, 2017 1:51 am 
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Joined: Sun Jan 03, 2010 9:45 am
Posts: 612
Location: bleedin Sweden
Here's a thread on this well known problem:

viewtopic.php?f=31&t=14369


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 Post subject: Re: Sonor Designer floor tom mounts won't hold legs w/o mem
PostPosted: Tue Jun 27, 2017 2:23 am 
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Joined: Sun Jan 03, 2010 9:45 am
Posts: 612
Location: bleedin Sweden
123hitit wrote:
I am the proud owner of a new (to me) 5 piece Sonor Designer kit...


Image

Whoa! That's a nice one! What are the sizes? Guessing 12-14-16-22 with an additional 10.


Last edited by spelman on Sat Jul 08, 2017 9:33 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Sonor Designer floor tom mounts won't hold legs w/o mem
PostPosted: Tue Jun 27, 2017 2:18 pm 
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Joined: Sun Jun 26, 2011 3:34 pm
Posts: 26
Location: Austin, TX
spelman: yes indeed there is another 10" not pictured. Its in as great shape as the rest of the drums. I also got a ton of the original hardware too.

As mentioned, these lived in church most of their lives so they came tome in super great condition for their age (the floor tom mounts issues notwithstanding) :| I also got the 6/5 x 14 maple veneer snare you see in the picture, but I sold that pretty quickly already to offset the cost. It was a fine snare. Except for a small piece of rubber coming off the throw off, it was dead mint... I just like the yellow lacquer!

Here's a little more back story on this kit:

The seller said the church bought them directly from the tour manager for Earth Wind & Fire!... so I was even more stoked to get them thinking that the great Maurice White (may he r.i.p.) had played them... but it's looking more like a great pro drummer named Mike Shapiro played them. He was associated with EW&F for a time... (there were cases for 3 of the drums with his name stenciled on them). Mike is a monster drummer.. plays/has played with lots of greats... just Google him.

On a related note if anyone has has any other yellow lacquer Designers they wanna part with let me know... I'd be all about getting a matching snare, an 18"f/t & an 18", 20" or 24" BD... (yes I know will be hard to find) but figured I'd float it out there. If I had the $ to order some SQ2's to match I would do it in a heartbeat.


... back to the posting topic: These floor tom mounts are starting to really bug me. I've read the other posts with ideas on how to fix up & down. As for the nickels solution, I had high hopes for a cheap fix... but I tried it in all 6 mounts and they ALL still move. It appears the current "shape" of the hole where the legs go through is now almost like an oval... whereas of course the legs are still perfectly round.

I posted more pictures of what I am trying to describe here @ the dropbox link.

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/7osxb6p5gcga ... 5Hjva?dl=0

It doesn't look to me like any amount of pressure will work because the shape of the brass piece along with the shape of the metal piece beneath it aren't anywhere near round/circular anymore. Looks like the legs grounded down the shape over time... like was mentioned in the other post... Not sure what to do from here :roll:

Of course a work around is to just use the mem locks and/or an aftermarket suspension mount for the 2 floor toms... the ones that keep the drum on legs but obviously I'd to get these mounts working correctly.

Thanks,

Mike H.
Austin, TX.


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 Post subject: Re: Sonor Designer floor tom mounts won't hold legs w/o mem
PostPosted: Tue Jun 27, 2017 4:23 pm 
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Try three nickels instead of one if you haven't already.

LMK.

Worked for mine back then.

_________________
VJ
Quarantining Link Era Sonor Drums Since 1998.


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 Post subject: Re: Sonor Designer floor tom mounts won't hold legs w/o mem
PostPosted: Wed Jun 28, 2017 8:06 am 
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Joined: Sun Jan 03, 2010 9:45 am
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Location: bleedin Sweden
The SQ2 / Prolite bracket has a 3-hole pattern, so you absolutely have to drill new holes if you choose that route.


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 Post subject: Re: Sonor Designer floor tom mounts won't hold legs w/o mem
PostPosted: Sun Jul 02, 2017 1:31 pm 
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Joined: Sun Jun 26, 2011 3:34 pm
Posts: 26
Location: Austin, TX
Here's a quick update:

I was able to score 6 new, "thrust washers" (1 for each f/t mount) from Samiam in Southern California. If you don't know Sam is a super cool guy & the number one Sonor dealer in the U.S. He's super passionate & knowledgeable about Sonor & in my experience always happy to help.

Sadly, the thrust washers did not solve my issue. I tried them with up to 3 nickels in the mount… no joy but I think I know the real problem now…

I noticed that the knurling on the f/tlegs is almost totally gone. All 6 of my f/t legs feel almost totally smooth. It seems the knurling has been worn down to almost nothing over the years of set up & break down... the fatal flaw in the design of this mount it seems... so it occurred to me the lack of knurling is why there’s no grip anymore.

So I set out to try new floor tom legs. 9.5mm & 10.5mm are too small… they just fall through. 12.7mm (like for Gretsch or DW) are just slightly too big… wouldn’t go in the hole. By coincidence, I had a 12 mm Ludwig accessory rod hanging around that goes to their newer Atlas mounts… (which I have a box off 3 of) so I tried that.

https://www.amazon.com/Ludwig-LAPAM3-Br ... B00F1G86P4

https://www.interstatemusic.com/903817- ... AP4RD.aspx


12mm is the winner! 12mm appears to be the exact diameter of the Sonor floor tom leg. With the new thrust washers, the small 12mm piece of Atlas rod held great... so now I have a 3 pack of Ludwig 12mm floor tom legs on order. (Ludwig-LAP5025T)

https://www.amazon.com/Ludwig-LAP5025TL ... B00FBSM5OK

They’re coming via UPS supposed to get here July 6th. I’ll post an update here what happens when I receive those... really hoping these will do the trick.


If that somehow that doesn’t work, the only other options will be be to remove the Sonor mounts & use an aftermarket/non Sonor solution...

... like 3 of the Ludwig Atlas mounts & legs (see links above);


or Gauger Dynamounts which look pretty cool & get rave reviews:

http://www.gaugerpercussion.com/dynamounttrade-fts.html

(One actual advantage of this route is that it will make the drums lighter. The mounts themselves & the legs for them, like all of the other crazy over engineered hardware on this kit, are kind of heavy)...

or 3 of these by this this other company that makes a retro fit mount:

http://www.indedrum.com/products/inde-s ... ng-bracket


Of course all of these solutions will show holes in the drums where at least two of the four holes where the mount was removed… but I can live with this. At least I know there is a workable solution on the horizon!

I’ll keep you all posted,

Thanks Again,

Mike H.
Austin, TX


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 Post subject: UPDATE 7/7: Sonor Designer floor tom mounts won't hold legs
PostPosted: Fri Jul 07, 2017 1:47 pm 
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Joined: Sun Jun 26, 2011 3:34 pm
Posts: 26
Location: Austin, TX
The new Ludwig 12mm f/t legs with the existing mounts worked... didn't even need any nickels though I did install 6 new thrust washers provided by Samiam. The legs don't move ... although the mounts themselves have a very slight bit of play from left to right... but it "works".

Also taking them in & out is not easy. These legs have heavy thick knurling & it makes inserting & moving the legs up & down through the mount hard... & you can feel and hear the knurling wearing off each time you do it... but like I said I have a working solution.

Honestly if I was going to be gigging heavily with these, I would probably remove the 6 mounts all together & put on Gauger Dynamounts like I mentioned before. I would use the existing 12mm Sonor legs that came w/ the kit. Not a cheap solution cuz these are $100 for each floor tom & I'd also have to buy 6 more mounts that take a 12mm rod... like these:

https://www.amazon.com/Gibraltar-SC-STL ... B0002F79N4

...however this would offer no knurling wear problems, easier/faster adjustment & setup/breakdown... & it would also def lighten the weight of the drum... these stock mounts are heavy!

Another reason this would be a good solution vs Luddy Atlas mounts is; if you install 3 Atlas mounts for f/t mounts they add a lot extra diameter to the drums... so you'd have to put a 14" f/t in a 16" f/t case... & a 16" f/t in an 18" f/t case. The Atlas mounts are versatile & awesome, but this is 1 drawback of them.

Guess that'll do it for now... but still toying with getting the Gauger Dynamounts. If I go that route, I'll post an update.

Thanks to everyone for their thoughts & input. Love this community! Mike


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 Post subject: UPDATE 7/7/17 Sonor Designer floor tom mounts won't hold leg
PostPosted: Fri Jul 07, 2017 1:48 pm 
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Joined: Sun Jun 26, 2011 3:34 pm
Posts: 26
Location: Austin, TX
The new Ludwig 12mm f/t legs with the existing mounts worked... didn't even need any nickels though I did install 6 new thrust washers provided by Samiam. The legs don't move ... although the mounts themselves have a very slight bit of play from left to right... but it "works".

Also taking them in & out is not easy. These legs have heavy thick knurling & it makes inserting & moving the legs up & down through the mount hard... & you can feel and hear the knurling wearing off each time you do it... but like I said I have a working solution.

Honestly if I was going to be gigging heavily with these, I would probably remove the 6 mounts all together & put on Gauger Dynamounts like I mentioned before. I would use the existing 12mm Sonor legs that came w/ the kit. Not a cheap solution cuz these are $100 for each floor tom & I'd also have to buy 6 more mounts that take a 12mm rod... like these:

https://www.amazon.com/Gibraltar-SC-STL ... B0002F79N4

...however this would offer no knurling wear problems, easier/faster adjustment & setup/breakdown... & it would also def lighten the weight of the drum... these stock mounts are heavy!

Another reason this would be a good solution vs Luddy Atlas mounts is; if you install 3 Atlas mounts for f/t mounts they add a lot extra diameter to the drums... so you'd have to put a 14" f/t in a 16" f/t case... & a 16" f/t in an 18" f/t case. The Atlas mounts are versatile & awesome, but this is 1 drawback of them.

Guess that'll do it for now... but still toying with getting the Gauger Dynamounts. If I go that route, I'll post an update.

Thanks to everyone for their thoughts & input. Love this community! Mike


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